[Overhaul] Power Mechanic 3 [Finished]

Power Mechanic Overhaul Threads: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5

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There were 2 issues risen in part 2 that we couldn't reach with simple discussion, so we decided to put them to a vote.

The first issue is Dethstrik Eradicator's ability's power requirement. We're debating whether it should be 12, 2 of the new Ultra Cells, or 14, 2 new Electric Companies. It's important to note that, currently, both Eradicator and Zeus need the same amount of power for their abilities, 4, and we decided to increase Zeus to 14 power (not including the power he generates himself).

The second issue is Ultra Cell, and if it needs a nerf. Both Hermes and Stone Hammer are going to need 7 power to attack now, just outside of Ultra Cell's range, so it may not need a change.

Any stat changes to monsters or power requiring effects will be addressed in the 4th thread, after we decide if Ultra Cell is to be nerfed.

what can ultra cell power on it's own now? (now being with the decided changes from part 2)

How much is Power Cell going to generate? I'm too lazy to go re-check.

Two power.

Under the new plan:


Power Provided:
2 Power: Power Cell
3 Power: Plasma Pack, Gravity Pack, Stellar Pack
4 Power: Solar Panel, Fossil Engine, Nuclear Plant
6 Power: Ultracell Battery, ZFF-90 Zeus
8 Power: Electric Company
10 Power: Hydrogen Cell

Power Required:
2 Power: Diamond Clockwork, Shadow Clockwork, Stellar Clockwork
4 Power: Clockwork Paladin, Missilepod
5 Power: Deadly Appliance, Quantum Clock
6 Power: Dethstrik Eliminator, Dethstrik Eradicator
7 Power: MX-5 Stonehammer, ZFF-24 Hermes
8 Power: ZFF-90 Zeus (14 after including his own generation)
12 Power: Dethstrik Eradicator's ability?
14 Power: Dethstrik Eradicator's ability? ZFF-90 Zeus' ability (20 after including his own generation)

Is Deadly Appliance also going to be in this thread?

Also is the monster portion of this thread going to be only stats or will the drawbacks of not having enough Power possibly being changed also be debated?

DA is in the same position as a decent number of cards; the effect that currently gives enough power to let him do his thing is about to fall short of the target. I see no reason why we should make an exception for him when it comes to how we handle this. DA , along with Hermes, Stonehammer, Zeus, Clockwork Paladin, Missilepod, and, depending on the results of this thread, Dethstrik Eradicator, will be discussed in the next thread 5th thread. They may or may not be boosted. I promise nothing.

As for the drawbacks of not having enough power, you can make a 4th thread to address that after we're done with this one. We have a decent amount of time until these changes take effect, and I'd like to discuss them in detail. Overhauling an entire concept is a lot more work than I thought though. I can see why web didn't want to do it. I have to keep adding more threads to deal with different problems and the wants of different people. If we had done this in one or even 2 threads it would have taken forever.

After thinking it over even more, I'd have to say Eradicator would probably be good within range of Hydrogen Cell. Could anyone tell me why this card should be the only power card that is out of H-Cell range?

1) it's not. Zeus is too
2) Free, repeatable destruction just because you have an H-Cell out is so very, very broken

Because it's an incredibly powerful ability, with no extra costs, on a cheap monster with pretty good stats?

Because if we don't have cards with requirements >10 Power then there's little point to having multiple power providers?

And Zeus is also outside of Hydrogen Cell range.

And Hydrogen Cell isn't bad as a tricolor generator on its own, it doesn't need to be able to power every card in the game by itself, and it'll be even better with the TTE/Overload nerfs. I wouldn't actually mind it providing only 8 or 9 power, with the current setup.

As for Zeus, I probably wouldn't mind if it obliterated entities, if we got Secret Asteroid Base nerfed

Can we fix Quantum Clock, too?

Cause it's kinda... shit.

Yeah, but that's got nothing to do with the overhaul, and could use its own thread. Besides, it needs more than a simple number change.

Oh, right. I missed the second half of that last line, so I missed Zeus' ability listing.

Is there anything wrong with putting them both at 12 power for the ability, then? That puts them in range of:

• H-cell + P-cell
• H-cell + Pack
• 2x U-cell
• 3x Drawback

This is when considering the removal of cantrip on U-cell, it wouldn't be as fine if this change wouldn't go through. But with that in consideration, it all seems good to me.

Making it in range of two U-Cells isn't really a good idea.

Repeatable, free destruction is very potent.

Aye, but 2 U-Cells that don't cantrip may not necessarily be as potent. It's hard to imagine what the effects of removing cantrip from U-Cell will be as U-Cell has been almost the basis of Power decks thanks to its versatility and being able to be substituted for P-Cell as a standard generator.

I'm not certain about the drawback gens either. Do we still have plans to alter Fossil Engine's drawback into something that really is a drawback or will it continue to be the bane of Chimera and Tablet Golem decks? If having 3 drawback gens in play really becomes a solid drawback (at least for dark/light and dark/grey) then I would think 12 Power for Dethstrik Eradicator's ability could workout as being fair. For Zeus, the proposition of 12 Power requirement is excluding it's natural Power generation right (i.e. whatever number we propose is how much Power gens other than itself are needed)?

Quick EDIT: To elaborate on the drawback gens, currently the drawbacks are a slap on the wrist. I want to know if the idea is to continue to keep them like that or if they should be harsher to reflect how useful they are as a combination dual-gen and Power provider? Before when Power cards were pathetic these were as harsh as the penalties needed to be; but now that we're overhauling the system, I'm wondering if that aspect should be changed.

Does anyone else want to increase the drawbacks of the drawback gens?

(09-15-2008 04:59 PM)Ignacio Wrote:  Does anyone else want to increase the drawbacks of the drawback gens?

i do
well...not increase so much as change

Change without increasing? Why? Or did you mean change in a way that makes them bigger drawbacks?

Nuclear Plant and Solar Panel are fine. Fossil Engine needs to be changed so that it can't be so easily turned into an advantage

(09-15-2008 07:08 PM)Noodle Wrote:  Nuclear Plant and Solar Panel are fine. Fossil Engine needs to be changed so that it can't be so easily turned into an advantage

Indeed.

Discarding is a shitty disadvantage, and needs to be fixed in more cases than this (looking at you, Remembrance).