Laying Nate/George to Rest

Still, the obvious solution to delete this poll and make a new one was refused by the maker of the poll!

I'm not so stubborn as to make my own poll, or delete this one, so I'll politely wait for BlackFox to reconsider his refusal (if he does).

Why poll it? Surely we can decide through reasoned discussion, as opposed to strengths in numbers?

Besides, you'd need to make sure that the poll allowed options such as "equally for either balance" and somesuch intermediates, as it's pretty hard to give a boolean yes/no answer.
Also, polls don't let you change your mind in case you're swayed by the opposition's arguments. Or bribed.

Mireille-chan Wrote:Why poll it? Surely we can decide through reasoned discussion, as opposed to strengths in numbers?

Besides, you'd need to make sure that the poll allowed options such as "equally for either balance" and somesuch intermediates, as it's pretty hard to give a boolean yes/no answer.
Also, polls don't let you change your mind in case you're swayed by the opposition's arguments. Or bribed.

It's not like I want a poll. I'm meeting up with the people who do seem to think polls are a good way of measuring the overall opinion on a card. Heck, some even think it's a way of making the final decision on a card's balance!

1. I wasn't aware that there was a second consented popular opinion that had been around for a while. "Oops" on my part for missing it.

2. Lol I didn't see this kind of support for polling CMC card balance in the thread that was actually ABOUT using polls for CMC card balance. Still I'd have to agree with MooN and Shuryou in that polls are not only limited in choice but also can be biased by the poller. If I added "and would give Shuryou a swift kick to the Jimmy" to the Mill on use idea, it would get votes simply because of the level of hatred Shuryou has gained over the years with his baka VCH hunts (that and probably more then 50% of CMC players would jump on any bandwagon that involved kicking someone in the Jimmy). CMC players just aren't mature enough (apparently) for a serious poll to work.
The reason, which I've stated twice already, for using a poll for this card was to try and get around the problem of no nerf being concluded upon due to there being too many good ideas. So I went with the weakest, least debatable (or so I thought at the time) change to try and press people to go with ONE THING as opposed to going off in a variety of directions like typically happens. Despite the poll failing, I got the results I wanted :).

3. I can't edit the poll even if I wanted to (which at this point I think is useless sense it seems Web's idea has been consented to and the topic of the thread has changed entirely). I get this:
You do not have permission to access this page. This could be because of one of the following reasons:

1. Your account has either been suspended or you have been banned from accessing this resource.
2. You do not have permission to access this page. Are you trying to access administrative pages or a resource that you shouldn't be? Check in the forum rules that you are allowed to perform this action.
3. Your account may still be awaiting activation or moderation. (Resend Activation Code)

So ya. If you really want to fiddle around with it at this point MooN, go ahead.

Well, I could easily delete the poll and make a new one..
Well, now the poll is gone. But since there's going to be an automill and some cost reduction, we might as well discuss what would be a suited cost for the automill N/G.

I personally wouldn't want the cost reduced, because the card is so strong with Bakuga.
I'd also like to note that as soon as the automill change is implemented, I'll be making my own Bakuga deck to see if I'm right about how strong it could be, instead of talking a lot without knowing what I'm talking about.

My suggestion would be to keep the cost at 7 and add the automill, then test it with bakuga to see if it's too strong. If it seems just right, then all the better. If it seems too weak, it's only a small tweak from there on.
If it's too strong, then I'll laugh and say I'm right.

How's that for options?

me likey, 6 mana has always been a key point and was probably a major cause of people hating N/G whether or not they realised it, it's just too fast at 6 for what it does.

Again I'm willing to go with just about ANY change. Auto-mill at 7 sounds fine. Unless we have objections, I think we have a winner.

Yeah, whatever. Any change is fine.

Aw damn. My only objection to automill is that it kills the Blurry Trophy deck. But that hardly sees enough play (still haven't got around to publicising it) to warrant an argument.

But... I know at least eighteen people that use the Blurry Trophy deck! Man, talk about killing a great theme...

For those of you who don't know what they're talking about (myself included until I did a little searching), I think this will explain it:

http://forum.cmc.redleaf.de/showthread.php?tid=2535

Bump for this now being possible with Mechanical Chaos, Re: Fossil Engine.

Necro'd with a new proposition for balancing since it still seems to be one of the most hated cards based on how the balance discussion is going. Instead of milling on activation/start of turn ( I really, REALLY like having a card that stops decking), why not make it double dizzy to kill a creature?

how about just give it a counter of 3 and leave it how it is.

i mean, till stops decking and kills creatures, but can only limit the lockdown effect of it.

I'll point out there's a reason this thread ran for 4 pages on the subject of changing 1 card.
Anyway, you can still use N/G as anti-decking so long as you don't use the ability for mill on activation. The no drawing attribute of N/G is SUPPOSE to be a PENALTY. You should have the benefit of either the monster destuction or the anti-decking, not both.

Just beg webrunner for a new antidecking card...

We've not had any vouchers for an unspecified amount of time.
There's no new secret card (while there are new and secret cards).
An idea for part of the next donation card's ability?
A participation award (a la magmite) for Storm?

Anyway, antidrawing as a drawback is nigh universally agreed as not strong enough to balance N/G. And antidecking as a bonus is definitely overpowered and very easy to use (it's not just some niche use like some other cards).

make the ability cost mana perhaps?

could N/G possibly be either-or on the ability usage and no-drawing?
so you can't use it as an antidecking and a monster killer at the same time, but still allow people to use its anti decking functionality (but without the monster killing).
or perhaps make using the ability cause you to lose the next 2 cards in the deck to the graveyard as well as preventing card draw?

i admit i don't know the nate/george comic well enough to be able to know what is and isn't in flavour. but i sorta took a guess that some sorta duality wouldn't be too out of flavour

Ezekel Wrote:could N/G possibly be either-or on the ability usage and no-drawing?
so you can't use it as an antidecking and a monster killer at the same time, but still allow people to use its anti decking functionality (but without the monster killing).

Guess what mill on activation is.

Ezekel Wrote:or perhaps make using the ability cause you to lose the next 2 cards in the deck to the graveyard as well as preventing card draw?

The Big List of Balances Wrote:2. Ability use cost: Discard 1-2 cards from top of deck.

Already been proposed before.

We already have an anti-decking card as well:

Unless you're using a deck with less than 15 cards and doesn't generate and , you can use it indefinately.

well actually only if you have 2 in the deck. since it goes to the grave after the spell is resolved

Ezekel Wrote:or perhaps make using the ability cause you to lose the next 2 cards in the deck to the graveyard as well as preventing card draw?

I think our previously consented balance was exactly that, except milling just 1 card on activation instead of 2.

Also, if in doubt about flavour behind a webcomic card, the templates on the right hand side of their wiki pages have links to where they originate.