Synergy in CMC

If monsters with activated abilities can't use said abilities with Focus, then I don't like that idea for Norlaan.

Poison all other monsters when damaging a monster could work. Malatak has roughly the same number of stat points as Venomic at just 1 more; and for that 10 per turn poison damage doesn't compare strongly with the 22 Malatak can naturally do, though on that note a 2 turn poison (2 poison counters) would probably be good.

..so. You use Shadowforce Heart on Venomic Dragon?

You pay 175 to make an 85/140 monster, when you can just spend 12 and play clash Wizard instead which does a better job?

With 90 attack, you really, really don't need ToD

EDIT: Also expect the big post soon. I'm still slightly irritated (for reasons I can't really say without insulting everyone.), so just pretend I'm petty and it's me throwing a fit because no one's listening to me.

That said, if anyone who happens to agree with me wants to explain why a number boost won't work before I do, go for it. I'll either
A) Agree
B) Think you're a moron and post my own take on it.

Lowly Slime: Changing the +50%/+50% to +75%/+75% is a numbers boost. There's no need to justify it.

Skeletal Soldier: Also, having Skeletal Soldiers being able to give you life if you've got Hull Platings out would be silly. Taking (15-3X, where X is the number of skeleton monsters you control) damage would make more sense, as there's no lifegain involved, and it doesn't trigger life-loss abilities when it nets to zero. Still against it, but just saying.

Shining Dragon: Having thought about it, 7 and a slight stat decrease or 8 and a slight stat increase would probably be the best fit for this, really. I do like the ability suggestion here though, but think it'd need to cost more than 9 if it had that ability. Dragon King Saurizal's ability costs a lot to give +50% attack; 25% less damage equates to +33% more life (on a non-unique monster, so the ability could stack). Even on its own, it's a boost of +30 life.

Norlaan: Not sure whether that (Focus) suggestion is possible (yes it would stop dizzycost activated abilities btw), but a Melrak Ribbon ability would be possible.

---

And the Shadowforce Heart goes on the other high attack/low life monsters, not the Venomic Dragon itself.

dragon king is also a much bigger monster though
and you could make shining dragons ability say "other dragons you control" couldn't you?

Dragon King Saurizal is a much bigger monster, yes, but his ability equates to costing a lot relative to what a vanilla would cost. On Shining Dragon, it's maybe 1-2 overcosted at most, so the ability would be very cheap relative to what a vanilla would cost.

And yes, you could do that.

Oh, one point about those 90 attack monsters being able to kill pretty much anything? Your Shining Dragon proposal adds a bunch of stuff that they wouldn't be able to kill that Touch of Death could

Forgot Hull Plating. Ya your version is better masa.

For Shining Dragon, at 7 it would be +20/+30 over Scorpian. Considering that passes through the mid-cost range it probably wouldn't need a nerf at all. If I assume +8/+8 per mana, that's +24/+24 which is roughly where Shining falls.
And ya, the non-unique aspect is rather a good point unfortunately. Would be nice if this card had a little more to it. The ability seems kinda like a waste on a big monster (or for a monster with more than 15 attack).

EDIT: Oh neat this card used to be Spell Immune for a few days.

bubbleman2 Wrote:@Nacho: The thing is, I use it in a deck specially designed for it. I toss him in with high attack and low life monsters as well as healing monsters (three Bogeys...yeah). I use Shadowforce Heart to raise my monster's attack, and I use Venomic Dragon to pretty much kill all of my opponent's monsters. It's not a throw in card, but it is a good card if you use it right. Also, giving up 40 attack for 20 life and ToD 95% is way too good, so if Dash is a proper comparison (probably isn't but I can't think of a better one), then 10 is too low. Even if Dash gets a small ability, I wouldn't want to see Venomic Dragon at the same cost as him.

I know. I was thinking about it while I was watching my illegally downloaded anime, and I realized simple number changes aren't going to solve Venomic. Boost his attack and we lose what makes him original, the ability to kill any monster in exchange for the ability to kill players. Boost his life and he becomes too strong in decks like yours that can heal him, killing monsters at or above his cost but never dieing. And drop his cost and his ability to insta-kill DLK becomes too strong, not to mention the dash comparison. 2 poison counters on every one of your opponent's monsters when he damages a monster seems like the best idea to me.

edit: though he is a random card, and a random number of poison counters from 1 to 3 might be better.

Just by the way, if anyone considers a stat boost to be in order for Skeletal Soldier, being 45/21 would be enough to put him out of the range of almost every sniper in the game, so that alone would be a huge boost.

Edit: Instant destruction and poison to everything seems to me like he's encroaching on Zephyr/Malatak's domain a little. Adding mass damage onto a destruction monster seems odd to me.

Also, if he becomes too strong at 10, then surely he only needs a really small boost? That is, a boost worth less than that 1? Which the mass-poison suggestion ain't. If anything, poisoning just the damaged monster is ideal as it's similar to an attack boost, but only affects monsters rather than players (keeping him original, as you say).

@Noodle: I put Shadowforce Heart on the Bogeys and such while useing Venomic Dragon to keep my opponent's monsters form killing the Bogeys and such. It actually works.

@Nacho: I see where you're coming from, but I still think a 1 cost drop should be fine for now. I'm going to take a "wait and see" position on Venomic Dragon since I'm not 95% sure what exactly he needs to make him better. I think a slight cost drop is the safest way to go, not necessarily the most effective.

Maybe just one poison counter, or a random number from 0-2, but I'm against any boost that would only happen 5% of the time.

Have you tried replacing Venomic with Target Malfunction bubbleman? I used to use a similar combo with Venomic, Phantom Galgarion and Target Malfunction. Then one match I only drew Phantoms and Target Malfunctions and realized how pointless Venomic was for the theme. You might as well use Malatak if you want to keep the opponent's field clear so you can just slap them with your Bogeys.

Huh? But wouldn't Targeting Malfunction on its own mean that you don't destroy the monsters, and that you end up taking all the damage? You mean not getting any Venomic Dragons out didn't hurt you even though you were essentially just both attacking each other directly every turn (with you paying mana/cards every combat for the privilege?)

It seems to me that strategy could be stopped by just attacking directly and leaving back defenders, rather than attacking the Phantom Galgarions and such.

I know we're not meant to change non-random cards to random and vice versa, but well, we're not meant to add arbitrary new abilities and such either, so...

Why not just give Venomic Dragon (Touch of Death), if it's deemed that other numbers changes won't fix it?

I like the 95% ToD. It doesn't hurt too much and adds a fun little twist to the card.

Because that's still only a boost 5% of the time. For all intensive purposes he has ToD right now, and he's still not strong enough.

The thing I don't get is the idea that adding to its life would make it too strong (because it'd be better with life resets).

I mean, yeah, if you're talking like +20 life, I can see that. But why rule out +10 life, or +5 life? If something like +5 life is too much, then surely Venomic Dragon isn't actually too weak (or could be fixed with, I dunno, +2 life or +1 sac or something silly).

It just seems that smaller changes are being ruled out for being too big, while you're giving the okay for huge changes.

I think what masa is getting at is that adding "all other monsters are poisoned for 2 turns" is worth more than 1-2 which was turned down (reasons why being ignored). Thereby, the alternative should not be worth a full 1-2.

Well, one stated reason was it's effectiveness against Dark Lord Khrima. Well, I'm not sure which one he was talking about (all of them?), but one of them has (Boss) anyway, and that aside, it doesn't do anything against Dark Lord Khrimas that it doesn't do against anything else.

So I can either assume that Nacho doesn't have a clue what he's talking about, or that he does have a clue but just hasn't explained it coherently yet.

The other stated reason was a comparison to a 10 mana card, which would be fair enough if dropping the cost by 2 was an option and dropping it by 1 for some reason was not, but this is clearly not the case, so I'm ignoring it.

I don't really think adding life would be too strong, but again, a cost drop would be safer since its attack to life ratio would stay the same and it would virtually be the same card except easier to play. Adding life would change the card a bit and until I'm sure how the card needs to be changed I'm favoring a cost drop, not because it's less of a change balance wise, but because it's less of a change as far as the card's original purpose goes. Though if someone makes a good argument for why a life increase is in order for Venomic Dragon then I might agree. Also, if you're referring to my comparison to Dash, I wasn't saying a life boost would be too strong (I didn't even mention a life boost).